tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-30306964.post1818530540607438824..comments2023-12-16T22:38:40.273-08:00Comments on .: Thinking, One woman's storymenohttp://www.blogger.com/profile/18065283682414369608noreply@blogger.comBlogger52125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-30306964.post-73042469550112382742008-02-19T18:08:00.000-08:002008-02-19T18:08:00.000-08:00My husband has no friends...but your line "of cour...My husband has no friends...but your line "of course, mine are gay, but whatever...." could be me talking.Magpiehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15460136246441367993noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-30306964.post-40884687026731152142008-02-12T15:28:00.000-08:002008-02-12T15:28:00.000-08:00i understand wanting to meet the other person befo...i understand wanting to meet the other person before they hang out with them, sorry you got hurt.<BR/><BR/>i am the kind of person to be friends with both. sometimes you get along better with the wife, sometimes the husband thats just how it rolls.Mermaid Melaniehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02726231529791645694noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-30306964.post-50543604423247120442008-02-12T15:23:00.000-08:002008-02-12T15:23:00.000-08:00It sucks that this stirred things up for you, meno...It sucks that this stirred things up for you, meno. <BR/><BR/>I guess I read things into Joy's post that not a lot of other people seem to have read. I thought that she was essentially telling us that her spidey senses were tingling. I mean, she had to have some reason for her stance in the first place. It seemed to me that she was looking for validation and backup in her discussions with K.<BR/><BR/>Maybe I was wrong, but there's usually so much unsaid (and sometimes the person doesn't even know that they have underlying reasons for misgivings or caution). <BR/><BR/>Better safe than sorry is what I was trying to say over there.<BR/><BR/>Also, it always surprises me when potential concern over not harming someone else becomes a cause for such anger (like in Bob's first post).Jhiannahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13961562933937294762noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-30306964.post-31818051447378671602008-02-11T18:25:00.000-08:002008-02-11T18:25:00.000-08:00Meno, she's always had insecurities about our rela...Meno, she's always had insecurities about our relationship. Her self-image isn't great and with a massive stress-load lately, it got out of hand. We had a good talk and we're all good again. We actually talk more than we have in years, actually. :-D<BR/><BR/>Gary, I'm the same as you. I've ALWAYS had non-romantic female friends. I'm just not a man's man, I guess. Who really cares, the women smell better. :-DGordohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07601738885232775770noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-30306964.post-70325512382939362402008-02-11T17:53:00.000-08:002008-02-11T17:53:00.000-08:00you know, there is banter here online between wome...you know, there is banter here online between women and men, and chat and such, but either in-person or online, I think there is a line that a married or committed person doesn't cross. I know the line and can feel it, but how do you describe it to others? Bascially as a person who tries to be polite but who is awfully shy anyhow, I find it easy to keep women friends in the category of acquaintances. But I grew up with a sister and went to a college that had all women students, and my wife is sweet, I guess I am more comfortable with women than men, but that's the end of it. I'm married, and happily, and wouldn't jeopardize that.gary rithhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/18228113061045717115noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-30306964.post-9489412611375211032008-02-11T13:31:00.001-08:002008-02-11T13:31:00.001-08:00I'm with you, babe ...it does have to be approved,...I'm with you, babe ...<BR/>it does have to be approved, in a sometimes-unofficial-sometimes-very-official-and-loudly-voiced sort of way, before Man can just "hang out" with a chick the way he hangs out with the guys...Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-30306964.post-82683546576004138822008-02-11T13:31:00.000-08:002008-02-11T13:31:00.000-08:00holly, you have a cyberstalker? WTF? Someone nee...holly, you have a cyberstalker? WTF? Someone needs to get a life. To tell you the truth, if i thought it were a choice, i might choose to be gay. Although i recognize that would bring it's own issues.<BR/><BR/>mamap, i do what i have to so i can stay.<BR/><BR/>capacious, for those who are susceptible, it can be that slope. I believe that susceptibility is a choice too.<BR/><BR/>dick, you are so cute.<BR/><BR/>scott, that takes me back. Scary.<BR/><BR/>jennifer, i don't think you are naive. There is no reason to be wary unless you have some intuition otherwise.menohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/18065283682414369608noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-30306964.post-24531622245086569932008-02-11T07:48:00.000-08:002008-02-11T07:48:00.000-08:00You know, until other people bring it up as an iss...You know, until other people bring it up as an issue, it's not something I ever even think about, on any level. I'm not sure why. Surely, the fact that I have never been burned is one reason, and the fact that I've never been inclined to burn, another. We both have friends of the opposite sex, and it's never caused me a moment's anxiety, if I'm being honest. They're just people. Of course, I could be just naive, too.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-30306964.post-7792495946025085162008-02-10T17:01:00.000-08:002008-02-10T17:01:00.000-08:00Like Reagan said. Trust, but verify...Like Reagan said. Trust, but verify...Scott from Oregonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01331284708780612453noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-30306964.post-6491903246520244112008-02-10T16:46:00.000-08:002008-02-10T16:46:00.000-08:00I guess I am safe from this what with being an old...I guess I am safe from this what with being an old guy now. I don't think anyone would be interested in me. Although, I did find Pat and we married after both loosing our long term spouses to death. Maybe it is more that I now have no outside interest in friends of the opposite sex except in the sense of friends. And having a wonderful relationship sure helps.Dickhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12381970360203140143noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-30306964.post-49094342137579805032008-02-10T10:09:00.000-08:002008-02-10T10:09:00.000-08:00It is a slippery slope, male/female friendship out...It is a slippery slope, male/female friendship outside of marriage. The other night, I was at a party where most of the single women ended up gathered around the host's husband at the end of the night. I went over there too (because he was sitting behind the bar and a girl needs a refill, unnerstan?) and felt a little uncomfortable with all the flirting. But he is in a very secure, stable marriage and his wife is da bomb and if it bothered her, you couldn't tell. So much of it just DEPENDS. I have one friend who I KNOW my husband thinks is fab (she IS fab), and I don't like to think about it much. But it's not like I really believe he would ever do anything to betray me. It's that fear that lurks though, the fear that one day he will announce that he doesn't love me anymore, he loves someone else. It happens. Why, it happened to my very own mother!Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-30306964.post-63440543749848199372008-02-09T22:57:00.000-08:002008-02-09T22:57:00.000-08:00We all do what we need to do. I have always admire...We all do what we need to do. I have always admired your surety on things. Really.Andrea Frazerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14293267612840259503noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-30306964.post-2517668876603795542008-02-09T21:10:00.000-08:002008-02-09T21:10:00.000-08:00Yep, it's your old Holly! I have a cyberstalker n...Yep, it's your old Holly! I have a cyberstalker now, so I use a new moniker. <BR/><BR/>Now, I took an impractically pure position to consider the impurity that's practically everywhere, but, of course, I recognize that there are gradients of infidelity. And I think that marriage is a commitment to fidelity, as it's a commitment to loving and honoring and in sickness and health. There are so many ways we can fail each other. However, failings of omission, such as omitting tenderness and forgiveness, are less spectacular than sins of commission, like comitting adultery, and therefore garner less airtime. <BR/><BR/>Again, thanks, Meno, for supporting your gay fellow Americans and your gay neighbors. You are our sister.Your Old Hollyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11774850519073877686noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-30306964.post-51495527081192923462008-02-09T20:47:00.000-08:002008-02-09T20:47:00.000-08:00joan, the man is solid! You are lucky, and you fo...joan, the man is solid! You are lucky, and you found that out early.<BR/><BR/>schmoopie, you and i have discussed this in person. An intense and interesting discussion. I love my gay friends. It amazes me that they would want to hang out with a middle-aged straight woman, but they do.<BR/><BR/>lynn, it's from Spiderman. It is the same as intuition. One thing i regret is that i didn't laern to trust it earlier.<BR/><BR/>holly, Holly? is that you? How i love to hear your unmistakable voice. I don't equate thought with action. Because god knows i have lusted "in my heart" But that's where it stayed. I am not pure, but i see a line and i never cross it. That's integrity, to me. I feel very, very stongly about marriage being between two people, without regard to sexual orientation. I know if i were gay that this would piss me off every day. As it is it only pisses me off every other day. Fucking hypocrites!menohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/18065283682414369608noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-30306964.post-82146568651550026962008-02-09T20:31:00.000-08:002008-02-09T20:31:00.000-08:00Hey, Meno. Intense post. Me likey. I like the B...Hey, Meno. Intense post. Me likey. <BR/><BR/>I like the Biblical definition of adultery, which is adultery contemplated equalling adultery committed. What I like about that is the divine refusal to sort folks into the pure and the impure. By the Bible, we're all sinners. The wife who watches a Brad Pitt film to behold Brad's abs is as guilty as the husband who rents a Motel 6 for a tryst. <BR/><BR/>Now, whereas I don't believe in God, I do believe in integrity. So, a spouse who asserts that they're pure, just because they didn't drop their drawers for a non-spouse, passes neither the Biblical test nor mine.<BR/><BR/>I also believe in getting on with the partnership that is marriage: beyond transgressions. It's not just that people lie. We all lie. And those who assert otherwise are lying about their veracity and duping none but themselves. We all reshape stories to suit a momentary purpose or an inveterate purpose and one isn't purer than the other.<BR/><BR/>And Meno, thank you so much for your "straight person for marriage equality" thingy. More and more, I'm ashamed to live amongst people (and especially divorced people and remarried people) who oppose marriage equality.Your Old Hollyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11774850519073877686noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-30306964.post-18829870351912616462008-02-09T13:18:00.000-08:002008-02-09T13:18:00.000-08:00I have never heard the term "spidey sense" before,...I have never heard the term "spidey sense" before, but I assume that it's the same as intuition. I have always trusted mine, and so far...I'm glad I have. Trust and the betrayal of it...are powerful. Using spidey sense is not only necessary...it's wise.Lynnhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12994258976391146989noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-30306964.post-9718332955189012402008-02-09T08:48:00.000-08:002008-02-09T08:48:00.000-08:00Trust issues that spill over from childhood do suc...Trust issues that spill over from childhood do suck. Stucco has been patiently enduring mine for years.<BR/><BR/>As a teacher of young children, I see many children form strong bonds of friendship with those of the opposite sex. Why should those friendships be terminated just because they grow up? Why should we discount the fact that we as adults could form those same friendships when we get older?<BR/><BR/>Every woman needs a gay man in her life. You are lucky to have some!Schmoopiehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10907884170679447978noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-30306964.post-12219764299734520912008-02-09T08:33:00.000-08:002008-02-09T08:33:00.000-08:00When Hubby and I first met and then moved in toget...When Hubby and I first met and then moved in together, he had many female friends from his running group and was such a flirt. When I left him for a month to travel through Europe with a friend, I spent most of that time worrying about what I would find when I got home. Thankfully, I learned early in our relationship that his flirting was just that and nothing more. I know what a lucky and relieved woman I am.Joanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05589769742639537861noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-30306964.post-15570456191729326762008-02-09T08:26:00.000-08:002008-02-09T08:26:00.000-08:00tt, i agree with that. Often it's not even about s...tt, i agree with that. Often it's not even about sex either. Like a friend who drinks too much, or has too much drama, or borrows money all the time.<BR/><BR/>suebob, when someone is like you, and i am like that too, i would NEVER violate anyone's marriage, including my own, then i am comfortable with whatever friendship my husband has with them. The Mister used to have this beautiful blonde admin. She didn't bother me a bit, because she was solid.<BR/><BR/>bob, i read that. I liked it. Very thoughtful.<BR/><BR/>ortizzle, there's emotional infidelity too. I think that's almost worse.<BR/><BR/>lu, it's human nature, true, and sometimes willful blindness about what's happening. Because it feels good to be flattered.menohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/18065283682414369608noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-30306964.post-53541275729572443552008-02-09T07:52:00.000-08:002008-02-09T07:52:00.000-08:00I think its human nature to be flattered by flatte...I think its human nature to be flattered by flattery and to get sucked into a kind of denial that things could go terribly when married people start friendships that exclude ones spouse-regardless of gender or sexual orientation. Balance--I think it's important to have some level of involvement with each other's friends.luhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14486545199810361580noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-30306964.post-21649995822730011322008-02-09T06:40:00.000-08:002008-02-09T06:40:00.000-08:00Sometimes a spouse will appreciate you more when t...Sometimes a spouse will appreciate you more when they have a little leeway with "friendships." If they don't, then it's not really about trust at all. <BR/><BR/>Neither of the above statements makes it any easier to bear when infidelity happens. I wonder if it would all be as important if sex were not involved.Ortizzlehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03709991994425909880noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-30306964.post-52318281030041976762008-02-08T23:22:00.000-08:002008-02-08T23:22:00.000-08:00I wrote a follow-up post in which I address trust....I wrote a follow-up post in which I address trust.<BR/><BR/>I am sorry that this caused you unnecessary angst.Bobhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13690660290319444722noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-30306964.post-83157750447355312252008-02-08T18:21:00.000-08:002008-02-08T18:21:00.000-08:00It makes me so sad. I have always had better guy f...It makes me so sad. I have always had better guy friends than girlfriends, and when women can't understand that I am not going to have sex with their spouse, it feels so insulting to both me AND the husband, like we are just some damn animals who can't control ourselves. I can; I do; I will always.SUEB0Bhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16301963922769609715noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-30306964.post-88783054054865798102008-02-08T18:06:00.000-08:002008-02-08T18:06:00.000-08:00I don't think anyone in a 'healthy' reciprocal( ke...I don't think anyone in a 'healthy' reciprocal( key word here)relationship should have friends that the other person isn't comfortable with. It doesn't matter the reason. If we see that a relationship we have with xyz is making our spouse uncomfortable and talking it our doesn't lead to a meeting of the minds where both are comfortable then unfortunately xyz has to go. Why? because of that oh so important vow we took. That's just my thought anyway. <BR/>Plus I think that women are much more intuitive about some things than men are. yeah, men can be 'stupid in public' but women can be 'coniveing bitches'.<BR/>Sad but true ...tthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14157492410943794052noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-30306964.post-90725926229951617182008-02-08T18:03:00.000-08:002008-02-08T18:03:00.000-08:00nancy, i can see no reason why you should be worri...nancy, i can see no reason why you should be worried, why you should make yourself jealous when you aren't. You know the people invovled, and if you aren't jealous, there's no reason to invent it.<BR/><BR/>deb, i don't think that we shouldn't go there. I am just sure that, as someone above stated, that we go there with people who honor our marriages as we do.<BR/><BR/>ms. chica, Thank you for that. <BR/><BR/>luckyzmom, thank you for telling that story. It stings like a son-of-a-bitch to be dumped like that, alone, with a small child. It makes you wary. And it sharpens your belief in that radar.<BR/><BR/>crazymumma, Sometimes even just the invitation to meet them is enough.menohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/18065283682414369608noreply@blogger.com